The Epic Battle for Time

After Wulf accepted me as a member of the pack, I learned to do kyd's. If you haven't tried doing those exercises, I would recommend giving them a try.

The prompt you pick might grow into your next winning story. Instead of a page or two, do a flash piece. It can always grow to a full-fledged, contest winning effort.

@storysinger What are KYDs? I have two kids, is that the same thing? 😀  "Get to work, you two! Write me an award-winning story!"

@storysinger Also, happy belated birthday!

Kill Your Darlings. KYD. Make your character lovable, and then, (gasp) kill them. Brings a tear most of the time. 

Our judges want us to make them cry or laugh. So, KYD.

Thanks for the b'day wishes Sade.

I don't find time. I have no secrets. Last quarter's submission was 3800 words. I wrote about 3500 in the last 72 hours, most in the last six, including editing.

No, it wasn't procrastination. It was simply not being able to carve out the time otherwise.

I've got two teenagers, their activities, school run, I work full-time, I'm also an editorial assistant for Grendel Press part time (only a few hours/week, but still), spending time with wife and children, household chores, preparing dinner, etc. I have medical conditions that mean I have to get at least 6 hours of sleep, usually much more, or I can't function at work the next day. So staying up isn't an option. Many times when it gets to the evening and I have time to do something I want to do I'm completely drained from everything above.

This was brought up in a writing discord I'm in and one person, someone that previously won their monthly contest, replied that I have all that too and I still write 1000 words a day. Gee, that was a helpful comment!

So, I'd like to know secrets, too.

And I also love Frazetta. Are you a fan of the sword and sorcery genre as well?

@undreamedages I feel you! Wedging time free from between the cheeks of my daily obligations is an ongoing struggle. Do you mean the sword and sorcery game or stories written in the sword and sorcery style?

@storysinger also, how do you motivate yourself to write? Do you use wordcounts, contests, etc.?

@circle_shadow_star stories in the genre. Frazetta did a lot of illustrations for works in it.

@undreamedages Oh sure, I didn't realize it had a label. Now that I'm looking at the list I realize it includes a ton of my favorites: LOTR, Wheel of Time, Chronicles of Gor, the Earthsea trilogy, etc. If it has swords, magic, and especially dragons, I'm in! I'm 75% into writing a YA fantasy that might fit in this genre. Is this one of your writing/reading genres?

I also used to do historical reenactment and armored combat. Not choreographed fighting, real fighting with armor, swords, and shields.

@circle_shadow_star traditionally the genre is much narrower than that.

Most of the things you listed are heroic or epic fantasy, slightly different.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword_and_sorcery

I write and read pretty much every genre.

Posted by: @ellis

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Most writers I know have a demanding life outside of their writing practice. They have families, jobs, bills to scrub and teeth to pay. Finding an hour to pursue our craft amidst the obligations of daily life (I'm looking at you, dishes) is nigh on impossible.

How do you squeeze in your time? Are you one of those admirably organized people who have a set schedule, or are you opportunistic, picking off a page or two as time allows? Tell me your secrets...They could be as simple as keeping your favorite pens and paper everywhere, using dictation, or sacrificing small animals to Odin.

I'd especially like to hear from @wulfmoon @tj_knight @reigheena @gideonpsmith @morgan-broadhead @doctorjest @undreamedages @toddjones @crlisle! @pegeen

The above image is "Victorious" by one of my faves, Frank Frazetta--aka how I feel when I actually bang out a few thousand words in a day.

So I don't actually make time for writing. What I do make time for however is writing related things. So I am a member of a reading group of writers, and we get together once a month and discuss one of the hugo or nebula short story nominees we've all read in preparation. We talk about techniques that were used. I also attend a monthly writers salon which is just writers discussing craft etc. I try to be involved in this forum, and a  discord channel that is writing based. I listen to a couple of writing podcasts, though irregularly. And I make sure I have time to read genre short stories. The key is I only do the bits I find fun.

And what I have found is that while its true that all takes time, as none of it is a 'chore', I find it easy to commit to. For me, the result of that "writing adjacent" activity is I get inspired! I get excited about a story idea or can't wait to try out a new writing craft trick someone has talked about, or I see/read something where they do something and I think its neat and I want to put my own spin on it, or try the technique. 

And so then it's less of a struggle when I do come to write. I have my idea or what I'm going to do, and I want to get down and write it, so I'm more efficient, more motivated and I use scraps of time to write that if I weren't already *psyched* to write would probably have been used for veging in front of the TV or something.

I find this works better for me than committing to writing or staring at a blank page, or determinedly trying to come up with  story idea, or locking myself in a room till I have produced 1000 words or whatever. 

As I begin this, it's 4:47AM. I've been up for a bit, getting coffee, feeding the cat (In that order, sorry Mr. Frodo!) and tidying up (I put the dishes away I washed the night before so I've accomplished something for the day). I check the forum, approve new messages or nuke spam, comment where I can, (looks at comment about commenting, gets swirly eyes) then I open my WiP.

Today happens to be the day I aim to write the final scene for my trilogy. 222,000 words. Almost all of which were written in the dark, in the morning, just after feeding the cat (You're welcome Mr. Frodo).

I write every day. Or I try to at least. Sometimes I oversleep. When I do, it's like missing a dose of medication - I take the next one at my earliest convenience. Or I make a point to think extra hard that day and come up with a scene or a bit of dialogue and write it in my phone notepad or a real notepad and that gives me a launching point for the next day or time I'm at my PC.

The trick is to get in the habit of writing every day.

'Course, you need something to write every day... This is why I struggled with short stories. I'd bang one out, edit, rewrite, etc. and done. 6k couldn't sustain my habit and I'd be back to watching Netflix or playing WoW.
As long as you *have* something to write, you can attempt to build the Atomic Habit around that story (Or stories).

Real life intrudes. When my son was little I couldn't outpace him morning-wise. I was exhausted, work was still work, and I wrote in patches. Usually only when a Big Story Idea hit. This is partly why I subbed 32 times in 12 years (2.6 entries per year). I had to be okay with less production, hoping things would level out and I'd get my morning time back. Now, I have.

Writing space. Personally, I need one. I'd tried various places around the house, and eventually co-opted my daughter's room (she's grown, but this is her room when she visits). Some people don't need a space. (4:30) I do. If you do, keep trying to find it if you haven't, then pin it down and protect it.

I hope to learn to dictate. Martin's book is in my cart and I'll have it soon. That seems a good way to raise production though it may still require alone time. Driving, walking, doing the dishes, etc. That's writing without a writing space then transcribing. I have heard it works brilliantly for some.

And of course, read. The more you read the faster you can snap into writing. You start to think in prose, and there's less time starting at the screen before fingers start flying. Reading can be a great "cheat" because it's preparing you to write and it can be done at times when writing is impossible. Yeah, you still need time for it, but that time might be easier to find. I read during football games. Watching them is an exercise in trying to scrub beer, Ford truck, and insurance commercials from my brain. It's not as intense as reading while quiet (I do that too), but it gets the job done.

So: Don't give up. Try not to get discouraged. Decide it's a marathon, not a sprint, write when you can and smile at written words. Improve: read, read how-tos, stay engaged (here), and over time you'll have produced lots of great stories.

@gideonpsmith Hmm, this is an interesting approach I'd never considered, to naturally fall into writing via interest. Now that I think about it, when I watch or see something inspirational I'm much more engaged at the keyboard and the words fall naturally from my fingers. Thank you for your response! I'll be meditating on this.

Posted by: @ellis

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@storysinger also, how do you motivate yourself to write? Do you use wordcounts, contests, etc.?

I've reached the point with the KYD exercises and Wulf's prompts that I can do a 1000-word flash piece in two hours or less. Working them down to 500 and then 250 takes a little longer.

At times a story takes on a life of its own, so I run with it.

Angelique Fawn has a blog that I visit to find ezines accepting submissions and she gives hints at what they are asking for. https://www.fawns.ca/blog/

I do a lot of research, um, reading. I'm exploring two writers I've never read from before. Tom Clancy and Steven King.

On top of that I'm starting to get ready for nanowrimo which starts on Nov. 1st.

I'm also dusting off my Dragon program to get my word count up. I aim to have my highest word count for this nanowrimo session.

Posted by: @tj_knight

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I write every day. Or I try to at least. Sometimes I oversleep. When I do, it's like missing a dose of medication - I take the next one at my earliest convenience. Or I make a point to think extra hard that day and come up with a scene or a bit of dialogue and write it in my phone notepad or a real notepad and that gives me a launching point for the next day or time I'm at my PC.

The trick is to get in the habit of writing every day.

I have two days a week where I get dedicated writing time during the day instead of during the shoulder hours, and holy hell does every single thing try to shoehorn itself into those few hours.

'Course, you need something to write every day... This is why I struggled with short stories. I'd bang one out, edit, rewrite, etc. and done. 6k couldn't sustain my habit and I'd be back to watching Netflix or playing WoW.
As long as you *have* something to write, you can attempt to build the Atomic Habit around that story (Or stories).

In my pursuit of trad publishing, I've realized that no agent will likely look at me without any sort of accolades, so I'm working on my short form fiction. It's surprisingly difficult to write short stories, esp after only writing novel-length, but I know it will help my overall writing.

Writing space. Personally, I need one. I'd tried various places around the house, and eventually co-opted my daughter's room (she's grown, but this is her room when she visits). Some people don't need a space. (4:30) I do. If you do, keep trying to find it if you haven't, then pin it down and protect it.

I have this dream where I have my own quiet little office with books from floor to ceiling, and an empty shelf for awards. But for now, it's the kitchen table and a pair of headphones.

I hope to learn to dictate. Martin's book is in my cart and I'll have it soon. That seems a good way to raise production though it may still require alone time. Driving, walking, doing the dishes, etc. That's writing without a writing space then transcribing. I have heard it works brilliantly for some.

I recently tried dictation using my phone and it was the most god-awful experience, especially when you have any sort of fantasy names. My husband recommended giving the characters and places "normal" names and then go back and replace them all when I'm finished, but there's something disheartening writing about Michelle going to Safeway instead of Ka'alrog ascending the Trilliccan mountain range (these are hyperbolic names but you get the idea). I can type faster than I can dictate (thanks 1999 AOL chat rooms).

So: Don't give up. Try not to get discouraged. Decide it's a marathon, not a sprint, write when you can and smile at written words. Improve: read, read how-tos, stay engaged (here), and over time you'll have produced lots of great stories.

My other recent epiphany was that it is going to take many years of training, hard work, and focus to become anything close to the writer I want to be, and that's okay. To expect otherwise is naiive and foolhardy. So here I am, nosing around, asking questions, looking under everyone's hood in hopes that I'll find engines that run like mine.

Thank you for your thoughts and advice!

@storysinger Flash fiction is such a foreign animal to me; I need to try riding that lightning. The beauty of paring down a story or a concept to it's very essentials is enticing. Editing is where it's at! I'll check out that blog, too, thank you!

@tj_knight Wait, did you say you submitted to the competition 32 times in 12 years? WOW. The commitment. I'm super impressed. My copy of #39 just came in the mail yesterday and I'm thrilled to start reading it. Did you spring any of your larger form writing from these short stories, or were they all just exercises?

My answer to this is pretty irregular, but there is a thread underneath that I think is worth mentioning.

At times in my life, I tried setting aside specific windows of time in my day to write regularly. That worked sometimes, not so much others (for example, I find I write better in the afternoons and evenings than in the early morning). I also sometimes worked on a more loose schedule, whereby I wrote daily, but not at any specific time (I kept that up for about a year at the time), and at others still, I wrote with no timeline or targets at all, sometimes writing often, other times barely at all. But what I'd say I found was key, whether I was on a rigid schedule or more seat-of-the-pants for my writing time, was how I thought about my writing while I wasn't writing.

When my mind is out of gear, when I'm not thinking about writing during the day, when I don't have any ideas that I'm fired up to write, then when I'm on a schedule, I don't often produce work I like. I find it lacks something. And if I'm not on a schedule, then I may not sit down to write at all. But if I've got those ideas in mind, if there's something I'm looking forward to writing, then it doesn't matter so much which I'm doing. On a schedule, I'll sit down and know what I'm doing. And on a more loose approach, well, I'm going to find the time, because I want to find the time. The excitement and enthusiasm removes an emotional barrier, for me at least, and just makes it easier for me to sit down and do it.

For the most recent short story I wrote, I had the idea two days before I wrote it, but didn't have the time right then to just gear up and start work on it. Instead, I spent much of the day after thinking about it in my spare time, wondering about ideas, and starting to feel the shape of the story. By the time I did sit down to write, I knew where it would begin and end, what was being revealed through the course of the story, and how that revelation would be treated. I still discovered more ideas when I actually wrote it, and added pieces to it that I hadn't thought of--but the very first draft came easy to me, because of all that down-time work that happened away from the actual act of writing.

Posted by: @doctorjest

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My answer to this is pretty irregular, but there is a thread underneath that I think is worth mentioning.

At times in my life, I tried setting aside specific windows of time in my day to write regularly. That worked sometimes, not so much others (for example, I find I write better in the afternoons and evenings than in the early morning). I also sometimes worked on a more loose schedule, whereby I wrote daily, but not at any specific time (I kept that up for about a year at the time), and at others still, I wrote with no timeline or targets at all, sometimes writing often, other times barely at all. But what I'd say I found was key, whether I was on a rigid schedule or more seat-of-the-pants for my writing time, was how I thought about my writing while I wasn't writing.

When my mind is out of gear, when I'm not thinking about writing during the day, when I don't have any ideas that I'm fired up to write, then when I'm on a schedule, I don't often produce work I like. I find it lacks something. And if I'm not on a schedule, then I may not sit down to write at all. But if I've got those ideas in mind, if there's something I'm looking forward to writing, then it doesn't matter so much which I'm doing. On a schedule, I'll sit down and know what I'm doing. And on a more loose approach, well, I'm going to find the time, because I want to find the time. The excitement and enthusiasm removes an emotional barrier, for me at least, and just makes it easier for me to sit down and do it.

For the most recent short story I wrote, I had the idea two days before I wrote it, but didn't have the time right then to just gear up and start work on it. Instead, I spent much of the day after thinking about it in my spare time, wondering about ideas, and starting to feel the shape of the story. By the time I did sit down to write, I knew where it would begin and end, what was being revealed through the course of the story, and how that revelation would be treated. I still discovered more ideas when I actually wrote it, and added pieces to it that I hadn't thought of--but the very first draft came easy to me, because of all that down-time work that happened away from the actual act of writing.

I feel this. I'm always writing in my head. Well, almost always, probably at least an hour a day. Sometimes I jot down quick notes. So that way, when I actually do have free time to write it comes a lot easier.

I have about a dozen prominent story ideas in my head right now that I'm constantly bouncing off of, plotting, structuring, or coming up with a turn of phrase or bit of dialogue. Then at some point I get to sit down and put it all together.

I'm also inspired daily by things I've seen, read, or heard. Lack of inspiration or "writer's block" is something that's never been a problem for me. I don't believe the latter exists, really. But that's a contentious thing to say in a writers' community. So, my writing time is usually very productive.

Posted by: @ellis

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How do you squeeze in your time? Are you one of those admirably organized people who have a set schedule, or are you opportunistic, picking off a page or two as time allows? Tell me your secrets...They could be as simple as keeping your favorite pens and paper everywhere, using dictation, or sacrificing small animals to Odin.

I'd especially like to hear from @wulfmoon @tj_knight @reigheena @gideonpsmith @morgan-broadhead @doctorjest @undreamedages @toddjones @crlisle! @pegeen

Hi Sade!

You’re asking all the right questions. The truth is, every writer is different, and finds their own way to get in the writing time that works for them. Output is good, but I always say more important than word count is making your words count. So find an achievable plan with reachable goals within your own circumstances and Make It Work. Your writing muscles will beef up, and soon those goals you thought were stretching your limits are not even close to your potential. But it all starts with committing to something, and then sticking to it.

When I conducted my year-long Super Secrets of Writing Workshop in here (I’ve moved it outside to my Wulf Pack Writers group now) I made a simple goal for members, but they had to commit to it publicly and had accountability—they had to report they had achieved it. That first year, they had to write four fresh, original stories for the contest, one for each quarter. That was a reachable goal, and those that accepted the challenge grew in their skills just by committing to one fresh story every quarter. In subsequent years, I slowly cranked up the requirements while training the group in solid writing principles. As the Super Secrets grew, so did the group’s results as they studied and applied them. Practice makes perfect, but smart practice makes perfect happen faster. By perfect, I of course mean an aspiring writer’s ability to write a professional story that sells to respected markets, especially this one.

To help weed out an overwhelmingly common flaw in my workshop members’ stories, I shared an exercise I had developed to win the largest international flash fiction contest I’d ever heard of. 30,000 entries over the course of a year. Two of mine won Top Ten for the year, one of those earning Grand Prize. I named the exercise KYD: the Kill Your Darlings Exercise. Here’s where I began it in the Super Secrets of Writing Workshop thread: https://writersofthefuture.com/forum/the-contest-quarterly-topics-and-other-items/wulf-moons-super-secrets-workshop-challenge/paged/33/#post-28269

Learning how to say more with less is a vital skill, but there’s more to the exercise than training you in that alone. Those that grasped that and committed to the training—one full KYD exercise per month in addition to everything else—made rapid progress. Many won Writers of the Future through that training, and Zack Bright not only won WotF, he won the Mike Resnick Memorial Award grand prize with a KYD created in the workshop. David Hankins first published story came from a KYD I watched him create from a prompt right in my KYD Masterclass, and he went on to win WotF and so much more shortly after.

Practice makes perfect, but smart practice makes perfect faster. Find the program that works for you that you can achieve. It’s good to look at how others accomplish what works for them, but that’s them. You work on yours. 

I have full faith that you’ll achieve your goals, because you have the desire, you are fighting to find the time to write within your busy schedule, and you’re doing your best to learn. 

Thanks for the question. I hope that helps!

All the beast!

Wulf Moon

Posted by: @ellis

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Sacrificing small animals to Odin.

I don't schedule time, but rather get hit with inspiration and then push other things aside to write.  Usually, it hits when my wife wants me to do something and I go hide in my office and write.  haha

I'm a roller coaster writer that will go months without writing and then sit down and write for weeks straight.

I haven't tried crying out to Odin for inspiration, but maybe I'll try asking a lesser deity or demigod for help.  Hmmm

Posted by: @storysinger

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Kill Your Darlings. KYD. Make your character lovable, and then, (gasp) kill them. Brings a tear most of the time. 

Our judges want us to make them cry or laugh. So, KYD.

I always took KYD as trimming all the words that don't help your plot move forward.  I took a story from 7,500 to 5,500 words after applying KYD and it really did help the story.  I would say most writers could trim 20% of their story if they thought about it.

Posted by: @wulfmoon

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Posted by: @ellis

↑

How do you squeeze in your time? Are you one of those admirably organized people who have a set schedule, or are you opportunistic, picking off a page or two as time allows? Tell me your secrets...They could be as simple as keeping your favorite pens and paper everywhere, using dictation, or sacrificing small animals to Odin.

I'd especially like to hear from @wulfmoon @tj_knight @reigheena @gideonpsmith @morgan-broadhead @doctorjest @undreamedages @toddjones @crlisle! @pegeen

 

Hi Sade!

You’re asking all the right questions. The truth is, every writer is different, and finds their own way to get in the writing time that works for them. Output is good, but I always say more important than word count is making your words count. So find an achievable plan with reachable goals within your own circumstances and Make It Work. Your writing muscles will beef up, and soon those goals you thought were stretching your limits are not even close to your potential. But it all starts with committing to something, and then sticking to it.

When I conducted my year-long Super Secrets of Writing Workshop in here (I’ve moved it outside to my Wulf Pack Writers group now) I made a simple goal for members, but they had to commit to it publicly and had accountability—they had to report they had achieved it. That first year, they had to write four fresh, original stories for the contest, one for each quarter. That was a reachable goal, and those that accepted the challenge grew in their skills just by committing to one fresh story every quarter. In subsequent years, I slowly cranked up the requirements while training the group in solid writing principles. As the Super Secrets grew, so did the group’s results as they studied and applied them. Practice makes perfect, but smart practice makes perfect happen faster. By perfect, I of course mean an aspiring writer’s ability to write a professional story that sells to respected markets, especially this one.

To help weed out an overwhelmingly common flaw in my workshop members’ stories, I shared an exercise I had developed to win the largest international flash fiction contest I’d ever heard of. 30,000 entries over the course of a year. Two of mine won Top Ten for the year, one of those earning Grand Prize. I named the exercise KYD: the Kill Your Darlings Exercise. Here’s where I began it in the Super Secrets of Writing Workshop thread: https://writersofthefuture.com/forum/the-contest-quarterly-topics-and-other-items/wulf-moons-super-secrets-workshop-challenge/paged/33/#post-28269

Learning how to say more with less is a vital skill, but there’s more to the exercise than training you in that alone. Those that grasped that and committed to the training—one full KYD exercise per month in addition to everything else—made rapid progress. Many won Writers of the Future through that training, and Zack Bright not only won WotF, he won the Mike Resnick Memorial Award grand prize with a KYD created in the workshop. David Hankins first published story came from a KYD I watched him create from a prompt right in my KYD Masterclass, and he went on to win WotF and so much more shortly after.

Practice makes perfect, but smart practice makes perfect faster. Find the program that works for you that you can achieve. It’s good to look at how others accomplish what works for them, but that’s them. You work on yours. 

I have full faith that you’ll achieve your goals, because you have the desire, you are fighting to find the time to write within your busy schedule, and you’re doing your best to learn. 

Thanks for the question. I hope that helps!

All the beast!

Wulf Moon

 

That link isn't that helpful because you removed the details of the challenge and replaced it with a statement that you'd have to buy your book to get it, at least as far as I can tell.

Posted by: @doctorjest

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But what I'd say I found was key, whether I was on a rigid schedule or more seat-of-the-pants for my writing time, was how I thought about my writing while I wasn't writing.

Ahh, this is so true. I hadn't put it into words this way, but you're right. If you can harness that idling mental energy of the day, it's gonna be much easier for the ideas to flow. I often listen to writing podcasts while I'm doing chores or working out, so I can metaphorically punch four dolphins with two fists.

But if I've got those ideas in mind, if there's something I'm looking forward to writing, then it doesn't matter so much which I'm doing. On a schedule, I'll sit down and know what I'm doing. And on a more loose approach, well, I'm going to find the time, because I want to find the time. The excitement and enthusiasm removes an emotional barrier, for me at least, and just makes it easier for me to sit down and do it.

By the time I did sit down to write, I knew where it would begin and end, what was being revealed through the course of the story, and how that revelation would be treated. I still discovered more ideas when I actually wrote it, and added pieces to it that I hadn't thought of--but the very first draft came easy to me, because of all that down-time work that happened away from the actual act of writing.

Thank you for this advice! I think I'd been doing unconsciously in small ways, but now I can consciously use it, which is much more powerful. I appreciate your time and thoughtful care with answering, it means a lot to me.

@toddjones

I don't schedule time, but rather get hit with inspiration and then push other things aside to write.  Usually, it hits when my wife wants me to do something and I go hide in my office and write.  haha

I'm a roller coaster writer that will go months without writing and then sit down and write for weeks straight.

I haven't tried crying out to Odin for inspiration, but maybe I'll try asking a lesser deity or demigod for help.  Hmmm

I think you and my husband have the same working motivation.  

@undreamedages You can still learn it in that section, David, you just have to work harder for it. ? There is page after page of exercises from each phase, and extensive commentary as I taught it to workshop members.

@undreamedages Everything Wulf says is true. You don't have to buy his book; all the lessons are free right here on this forum. Ask David Hankins, he studied the Super Secrets on this forum, applied what he learned, and won. Like the great Rob Scheider said, "You can do it".

@wulfmoon that's a bit like trying to determine the recipe for a complicated dish by tasting it.

But I went back, read some, and skimmed most of the comments from 22 to 33.

I see the exercise. 999 words trying not to self edit. Then cutting that down to 500. Then again to 250. And you see that the 500 is a much better story showing that you may cut a lot, i.e. kill your darlings, and end up with something improved. Then you see that the 250 is much weaker showing that you can cut too much.

But, of course, that is only some of what was imparted there. I suppose if what you removed was just a summary of the advice and comments that you and others gave then it is all there.

Thank you