A response to cynicism

Thanks, Kent. I think anyone who's been in this contest (and also writing and submitting outside the contest) for a reasonable amount of time understands that rejections sting, yes, but they are also a part of the process. I think we also understand that the contest is judged 100% anonymously, so there is no chance the judges could ever be out to get anyone.

It's important to develop that thick skin, work on improving one's work and level of professionalism, stay humble and respectful, and realize it's all about the writing and nothing personal — unless, of course, one makes it personal by attacking editors or judges and creating a bad reputation for oneself.

I read that post with a great deal of dismay. Disappointment that one's time and effort might not receive the reward one expects...that ones art might not be appreciated...those are difficult things to face.

Perhaps the story was not accepted because it did not adhere to one or more of the Unwritten Principles so generously posted by Martin on another thread. He lists 17 Principles of Content, 22 of Structure, and 7 of Format. That's a lot to juggle and they're all important.

I would hope that this writer, who seems so ardent about their work, reconsiders the decision to boycott the contest.

I suspect the post was written in the grips of strong emotion. I imagine they will feel differently in a week or so. I try really hard not to respond to electronic communications when I'm in the grip of strong negative emotions. Let's face it, no one enjoys getting a rejection. Those who have a growth mindset are the ones who will rise higher. 

I allow myself a Five-Minute Rant for any rejection. I can't pretend rejection doesn't sting, so I let myself go. For five minutes. Then it's back to work.

So I don't judge someone for ranting. I consider the circumstances.

Most other contests/markets just give form letter rejections with no hint or guidance for if you are improving as a writer. WotF is unique with RWC, HM, and SHM scale. SFs even get some personal guidance on where the story needs improvement, which is fantastic. The only reason I didn’t throw in the towel on writing was because of an HM I received  Q4 2021 from WotF.

I've read some WotF winners over the last 5 years I didn’t care for based on my taste. Maybe I just didn't get them.  Most of the stories are written well with ideas/concepts that let me experience a topic from a different angle. That is pretty cool coming from writers who have not are not professional, yet.

Posted by: @toddjones

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I've read some WotF winners over the last 5 years I didn’t care for based on my taste. Maybe I just didn't get them.  Most of the stories are written well with ideas/concepts that let me experience a topic from a different angle. That is pretty cool coming from writers who have not are not professional, yet.

Time for one of my Frederik Meijer Gardens and Sculpture Park stories. (I have many!) This one is paraphrased, but essentially true.

Frederik Meijer loved sculpture. His wife Lena loved botanical gardens. Along with some advisors, they built a great horticulture/sculpture park.

They reached a point where Fred simply couldn't devote as much time to the park. He had too many business and charity interests. So he decided to hire a curator.

The leading candidate spent a lot of time touring the park, talking to people, and especially talking to his contacts in the art world. Then he and Fred had a meeting; and he said (again, paraphrased): "Mr. Meijer, you have a great sculpture park. But you will never have a world-class sculpture park."

"Why not?" Fred asked.

"Because the park is full of works that you like. If you truly want to represent the gamut of great sculpture, you must include works that you don't."

Fred handed him a contract on the spot.

OK, it didn't happen exactly like that. The process took a little longer. But the point is accurate. Something that truly represents the field must include works that you don't like, but that are excellent examples of a part of the field.

My apologies to some of you, but I simply don't like steampunk. But I have seen some great steampunk in the anthology. I'm not big on experimental work, but I frequently recommend Scott Parkin's "Purposes Built for Alien Minds".

"Better" is 100% subjective. I challenge anyone to provide objective measures of "better" that can be applied by 100 different people to 100 different stories and get even 50% agreement. But there are stories and genres and styles and characters who appeal to a wide range of people. Someone who studies the field can identify those and bring examples to your attention.

Oh, and Frederik Meijer Gardens and Sculpture Park was recently voted the #1 sculpture park in the country and a top 10 horticultural park. Come to Grand Rapids and I'll give you a tour.

(I'm not joking about the tour, but no one ever takes me up on it.)

Posted by: @martin-l-shoemaker

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Something that truly represents the field must include works that you don't like, but that are excellent examples of a part of the field.

That is so true. Everyone can't like everything. How boring would that be?

Posted by: @martin-l-shoemaker

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Oh, and Frederik Meijer Gardens and Sculpture Park was recently voted the #1 sculpture park in the country and a top 10 horticultural park. Come to Grand Rapids and I'll give you a tour.

(I'm not joking about the tour, but no one ever takes me up on it.)

That's only 2 hour drive from my place. I'll add it to my list of must sees.

Meh, they should just make wine with those sour grapes.

I write for myself, like I suspect most others here do. Not everyone is going to like everything. That's true for everything in life. It's great if others like it and read it, but that's not why I do it.

I didn't see their comment, but if their writing is that good they should have no problems finding a market to publish it. There are 1000s out there and someone will like it. If they are talking that big a game then it should be accepted at Asimovs, Augur, etc.

Getting mad at rejection is as productive as being mad at someone for not liking peanut butter. Maybe it's just I'm older and wiser. Or maybe it's that my day job for 20 years has been as a professional recruiter.

Rejection doesn't mean you are bad or your writing is bad. It may not even mean that you made a single mistake. Bottom line, it simply means they liked the other person or story better. Only eight can be finalists a quarter no matter how many great stories are submitted. And that's subjective, not objective. It's pointless to rail against it.

Posted by: @toddjones

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That's only 2 hour drive from my place. I'll add it to my list of must sees.

My membership includes one free guest pass. My tour includes my 100% fabricated explanations for the sculptures.

I'm 90% sure my recent 'R' was for the same reason the commenter got an 'R'... my beginning, while cute, took way too long to get to the point and I didn't realize that until about halfway through the next quarter, long after it was submitted. If I'm slush reading a couple hundred stories, I would have rejected mine too.

A slow beginning can sink a good story in any market. That's why the first 450 is so important.

Posted by: @wahlquistj

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I'm 90% sure my recent 'R' was for the same reason the commenter got an 'R'... my beginning, while cute, took way too long to get to the point and I didn't realize that until about halfway through the next quarter, long after it was submitted. If I'm slush reading a couple hundred stories, I would have rejected mine too.

A slow beginning can sink a good story in any market. That's why the first 450 is so important.

I am both my own worst critic AND completely blind to my own strengths and weaknesses. I depend heavily on my writing group to critique my stories and tell me what's working and what's not. Often I'm the opposite...my stories get off to a banging start, but then must fizzle out sometime after the first 450. I imagine Kary saying, "Well, I read it. I got through it. It wasn't horrible, but..."

But...what? What, Kary? Tell me! I need to know!

There are so few pro-paying markets and so many writers. Rejection is part of writing, if you're going to be submitting to markets.

I did two of Dean Wesley Smith / WMG Anthology workshops (sadly, they're not doing those anymore). Attendees would write a story in response to each editor's call for submission (about 6 day turnaround) (approx six different markets, with one week including multiple submissions).

All the attendees would read everyone else's story before the workshop.

At the actual workshop, all the editors would sit up on the stage and go through each story, saying whether they'd buy or reject the story, if it was their anthology. The actual editor would go last.

Yes, in front of everyone.

Often all the editors would hate a story except the buying editor. Other times, everyone would love it except the buying editor. And all sorts of permutations of that! Sometimes no one would like the story.

But the point was, all the editors had different opinions.

Sometimes they'd love the story, but it still wasn't quite right for the anthology, or someone else wrote something similar they liked a bit better, so your story would get rejected.

I can't say I got over the butterflies when it was my story's turn, but, you do get used to it -- and to not take it personally.

@stephcat tbh, and I can't think of a way to put this nicely, there are a lot of delusional people out there. And I don't mean like mentally ill delusions, but just their perspective of writing, especially their own, is way off. It's a bit like Dunning-Krueger or being tone deaf for music. There is a great deal of really poor quality stuff out there.

Anyone that's ever been part of a writing group, or had to review submissions should be aware of this. And if you don't know what I'm referring to then you may be one of the affected.

People that can't take rejection or criticism will never improve. It's one of the reasons imposter syndrome is a thing. Because, for the most part, anyone that "makes it," is well aware of their own flaws and weaknesses. You need to be able to distinguish that something is wrong in order to fix it.

Personally, I love criticism, and not just in writing, but in any field. It's how I improve as a person, and rejection is part of that. It's not personal.

@undreamedages I doubt the poster has had much experience at all. 

Story got rejected? feel sad for a moment, then send it to the next market. And keep learning and writing.

I kind of assumed, given the extremeness of it, the dismissal of everything, the insulting of past winners quality of work, and the fact the person joined just to post this, that this was the work of a troll.

That being said, I am aligned with the posts here that say - if this was a real person/real thoughts - this was a person in pain. The best response is to give them grace, support, and the benefit of the doubt. If they continue to be a forum member hopefully we can help. If they don't, then they will take their work to other markets and see how it is received there. Maybe they will come back. 

We all know how special this forum is, how very positive and supportive it is. That is where I will put my focus

Posted by: @martin-l-shoemaker

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I allow myself a Five-Minute Rant for any rejection. I can't pretend rejection doesn't sting, so I let myself go. For five minutes. Then it's back to work.

So I don't judge someone for ranting. I consider the circumstances.

IMO a private rant is fine, if the writer later looks for WHY his or her work didn't make the cut, once they calm down.  But a public rant is in bad taste and insulting to everyone who runs the contests, and everyone who works hard to submit good entries, and to everyone who places. Also, it damages the ranter's reputation. Who would want to work with someone like that on a book? When I read the post in question, the words "immature and unprofessional" came to mind.

My thoughts are going on three or four different directions, but here we go:

1) Writer's of the Future is the most competitive amateur markets.  You may have a sell-able story, but you're competing against a ton of people for 3 slots a quarter.  You may get an HM here and then sell it somewhere else.  Why?  Because the competition (likely, don't know, I don't actually get anyone's numbers) isn't as fierce there.  Plus, that editor could like your story more than Jody did.  Or that editor didn't get 6 stories just like yours, but Jody did.  Or your robot sexual assault story just might be a little outside WotF's PG-13 requirements.  Who knows?

2) You may love your work.  Doesn't matter, you're not selling it to yourself.  If you want to be a professional, you have to write something OTHER people enjoy.  I get very, very, very close to my stories.  That's why I need critiques.  My wife can attest that when I receive those critiques from others sometimes I complain that "they just don't get my story."  Then, after my 2 minutes of whining, I remind myself that if they don't get it, it is my fault.  I'm the storyteller, if they don't get it that's because I didn't tell it right.

3) In regards to rejection I'm an oddball on.  One thing I tell clients who job searching is to watch the mindset.  Many people feel like they lost something when they don't get the job.  That's not the case.  The reality is, they never had that job.  All that happened was...they still didn't have that job.  Yes, be disappointed, but then remind themselves that they lost nothing and the rejection isn't personal.  I have never won WotF.  At the end of Q2 I still haven't won.  I lost nothing.  Yes, it's disappointing, but then I remind myself I lost nothing, and my story would be perfect for a market that just opened up.  Time to suck it up and go back to doing things I find meaningful. 

Posted by: @gideonpsmith

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I kind of assumed, given the extremeness of it, the dismissal of everything, the insulting of past winners quality of work, and the fact the person joined just to post this, that this was the work of a troll.

They created their account several months before posting. Most likely when they submitted their story. The timeline fits for submitting that quarter and then receiving their rejection. I think it's unlikely they were just a troll. A troll would have dug in and kept trolling when they got a reaction. It was probably a genuine comment.

If nothing else, this has been a great discussion about professionalism, developing a thick skin, accepting criticism, and the tenacity it takes to be a storyteller. I first started writing back in 2011. I send every new short story to WOTF. When it doesn't win, I send it around to all the markets on The Submission Grinder.

Twelve years now and more rejections than I care to count, and I still haven't sold a single thing. Yet here I am, still writing. Why? Because I enjoy creating stories. If you come into this business hoping to get rich or win awards or land seven figure book deals, you'll be disappointed and miserable for a very long time. Probably decades.

Would I love to win this contest? You bet! Would I love to pro out? Sure! But even if I never sell anything, I'll keep writing. As a very experienced and very successful American horror author has stated, "If you can do it for love, you can do it forever."

@morgan-broadhead Wise words. You have a SF and 3 HMs, but haven't sold anything?

Posted by: @undreamedages

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@morgan-broadhead Wise words. You have a SF and 3 HMs, but haven't sold anything?

I tend to write very LONG short stories! LOL This contest gives us up to 17K, and most of my stories are +7K. The sweet spot for most short story markets is 3,000 - 5,000 words. Anything over that is a tough sell. That's the reason I keep telling myself anyway.

Posted by: @undreamedages

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@morgan-broadhead Wise words. You have a SF and 3 HMs, but haven't sold anything?

I haven't any luck selling anything either.

@morgan-broadhead . . . I tend to the LONG stories as well.  I struggle to stay under 10k, I'm not certain why.  My first two submissions to the contest were both over 13k.  One HM and one RWC.  My goal this quarter is to figure out how to stay under 5k!

Forcing myself to write Flash (~1500 words) has helped me in the past to hone that mindset that comes in handy in writing more medium length shorts. 

FWIW, I have a handful of sales to not-quite-pro paying markets....and a LARGE (digital) pile of rejections. 

Posted by: @stephcat

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and a LARGE (digital) pile of rejections. 

I've always been envious of Stephen King and his railroad spike of rejections. I've got an email inbox full of 'em, but a stake piled high would be more motivational, I would think.

I did print and frame my first ever rejection, though (thank you Beneath Ceaseless Skies). Forgot to do my hundredth. Might do my thousandth when I get there.

I wrote 46 stories, and all were rejected. Then I sold my 47th story and started making regular sales after that. From what I understand, this is a fairly standard path. One of the most important ingredients to success is persistence.