Discussion: Q2 Volume 40

I'm nearing the end of my first draft and it's running longer than I wanted. Still - I'm enjoying writing at the moment. Kind of don't want to finish it.

Well I have a first draft completed. Now I am going to put it down for a week so I pick up editing with fresh eyes and work on Resinick draft.

Posted by: @time

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I'm nearing the end of my first draft and it's running longer than I wanted. Still - I'm enjoying writing at the moment. Kind of don't want to finish it.

That's a really nice place to be, though. When writing is going well and you're enjoying what's coming out, those are the times when you're able to just get into the joy of it and enjoy the craft for its own sake. No matter how well those stories fare when they're completed, the writing itself already repaid you.

It's also a good sign, because usually, stories and scenes that are fun to write run a pretty high chance of being enjoyable to read! If it's an awful slog to write, I try to step back and double check what I'm working on--is it difficult just because it's challenging, either in its emotions or in the craft required, or is it just because it's horrible, boring, or otherwise awful, and I'm not enjoying it because it's not enjoyable? If it's the second, I'll try to condense it down as far as possible (including down to zero words, if at all possible).

@pegeen, @time, @craydimensional That's awesome!  *cheers*

I'm definitely a pantser when it comes to writing. My Q2 story is no exception. I do have an outline of the main character and their flaws/abilities, but how their character arc develops doesn't come to me to mid-story. Character, environment, problem ... go.  That's about the sum of how I write. Issue is that it causes a lot of wasted time and editing. 

I need to get better at outlining in advance.  To that end, I just read Libbie Hawker's, "Take Off Your Pants!" There are some good points I'm going to try and work into a hybrid version.  Kind of a "Writing in the sagging pants style!" You know how kids did starting in the late '90s.  Okay, I don't see how that style ever took off. Just saying, hard to breakdance or run away from the cops when your holding onto your sagging pants. haha. I just dated myself there. 

You get the idea about taking in ideas and adapting them to your style. I haven't figured my style out yet, so if you see me hopping down the street with one leg out of my pants, just roll your eyes and keep walking.  

For those of you who are recently new to writing and to the contest I have this to say, "Welcome to your new heroin addiction. It will consume you down to the very bone and to the core of your soul. If you're not prepared to be a hermit surrounded by every type of book there is, I suggest turning back toward much safer shores." 

I've been here 17 years. I've tried to quit writing numerous times, but it just keeps drawing me back into its wonderous charms though so full of heartbreak and wounds. Yet through writing and the books I've read, I have discovered the great mystery of the Universe. And in that discovery, I've learned the true purpose of humanity on Earth and my true purpose as human being. Not only am I writing for the remainder of this lifetime, perhaps 20-30 years more, but also, I am writing for my next life. I truly believe that writing, or any art, is woven by design into the true believer of his own particular craft. 

-Live long and prosper.  And love one another. 

Posted by: @toddjones

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I'm definitely a pantser when it comes to writing

I can be for my short stories. I find if something needs adjusting, it's usually easy enough to fix with an edit. I have to have an outline for my novels, though. Some pantsing is fine with them, but my plot goes all overthe place in a novel without some grounding

As much as I like my Q1 and think it has neat, original ideas, I like my Q2 better. 

Darn it, now i'm thinking i don't want my Q1 to win.

@corbin-maxwell beautifully said

Posted by: @corbin-maxwell

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"Welcome to your new heroin addiction. It will consume you down to the very bone and to the core of your soul." 

 ...

I've been here 17 years. ... Not only am I writing for the remainder of this lifetime, perhaps 20-30 years more, but also, I am writing for my next life. I truly believe that writing, or any art, is woven by design into the true believer of his own particular craft. 

 -Live long and prosper.  And love one another. 

Thanks for that. I retired and started writing seriously last year and love it. I've been writing for myself since I was eleven, but now I'm doing it for fun and hopefully to learn new ways to express myself. People ask me why I write, I paraphrase from Stephen King and say, "What makes you think I have a choice." That has always been the way for me. These damn ideas get in my head and I have to put pen to paper to get them out.

Not complaining, just stating how I'm woven together.

Peace to all my fellow writers who just don't have a choice.

Posted by: @time

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As much as I like my Q1 and think it has neat, original ideas, I like my Q2 better. 

Darn it, now i'm thinking i don't want my Q1 to win.

Nah, let your Q1 win if it can! If it does, your Q2 will have a chance to find itself another home in another market, so it won't go to waste. Besides, sometimes it's not your best story that wins, but the story you write that's the best fit--fit to the market, to the other stories in it, and to the editor or judge who's reviewing it. Your best story for yourself isn't always your best story for someone or somewhere else.

Nah, let your Q1 win if it can! If it does, your Q2 will have a chance to find itself another home in another market, so it won't go to waste. Besides, sometimes it's not your best story that wins, but the story you write that's the best fit--fit to the market, to the other stories in it, and to the editor or judge who's reviewing it. Your best story for yourself isn't always your best story for someone or somewhere else.

I expect no more than HMs. And I expect when I read the latest in a few weeks time, it won't be as good as it feels now. I get too attached to the story i'm writing.

Good luck all. Now onto another one.

Posted by: @time

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I get too attached to the story i'm writing.

I wonder if that's actually possible! ? I think if I wasn't attached to the story I was writing, I'd have a hell of a time trying to actually write it. I don't sit down to write anything that I don't expect to be good(*). I'm not always right, but I do always try to make something that I think is good.

Sometimes I just end up with stuff that I think I liked. Stories that I know, that I experienced, which didn't exist before. Maybe nobody else will ever really experience them, or very few, but even so, some of them will stick with me as much as any of the great stories that I've read by other writers. There are certainly one or two that I can think of that will probably never quite break out from that bubble, but which I still love, all the same.

(*)Addendum -- except for things that I know won't be good, but feel like they'd be fun anyway. I do write those too, every now and then.

Following this ^ one of my favorite things about the screenplays I wrote was that I saw the movie. I didn't have much expectation they'd sell. Ok, zero expectation, but I was cutting my writing teeth and having fun. Now I've got a bunch in my memory that happened exactly as I would have wanted them to, and I got to "see" them.  

Posted by: @doctorjest

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I wonder if that's actually possible! ? I think if I wasn't attached to the story I was writing, I'd have a hell of a time trying to actually write it. I don't sit down to write anything that I don't expect to be good(*). I'm not always right, but I do always try to make something that I think is good.

Sometimes I just end up with stuff that I think I liked. Stories that I know, that I experienced, which didn't exist before. Maybe nobody else will ever really experience them, or very few, but even so, some of them will stick with me as much as any of the great stories that I've read by other writers. There are certainly one or two that I can think of that will probably never quite break out from that bubble, but which I still love, all the same

I have a love-hate relationship with mine. And I have difficulty letting anyone crit them.

Perhaps no surprise that your own stories stick with you for a long time, You (we) spend a lot longer thinking about them, writing them and editing them than time reading any other. No one is going to know one of your characters better than you or understand your story better. 

I'm generally very close to my story and very attached.  I can agree that I find critiques hard, but they're almost always useful as it shows me how I'm to close (particularly knowing my imagine backstory, how I visualize things, etc).  That said I am sick of my stories about half time when I'm finally done with the final draft and never want to look at it again. So, some contradictory feelings.

Just submitted my Q2 story. After some feedback from a friend I made some final changes. This is probably my strongest story to date. This one is pure fun, I hope the judges enjoy it ? 

@pmg Good luck!!!

@pegeen Glad to hear it. Keep going!

I reread my Q2 story and it totally sucks. It just isn't percolating. I need to find a new entry point, maybe through my last character. Hate it when that happens.  

Posted by: @pegeen

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I reread my Q2 story and it totally sucks. It just isn't percolating. I need to find a new entry point, maybe through my last character. Hate it when that happens.  

It happens. Keep at it.

Had to put down my Q2 after completing the draft. The story has some slow areas that need to be fixed. Working on updating a previous HM from WotF that's SF for the Mike Resnick contest.

I peeked at my Q2 this morning after getting an idea of how to clean it up. After a cut, some splicing tape, and character arc reflection I ended up trimming 700-ish words (10%). That a whole transition scene that just didn't help the story. Reads better and lets me focus on the ending more than getting to the ending. Now I just need a good cymbal crash to bring it all together.

Be safe and write on my friends.

I've been doing the story a week thing in 2023 but just to first draft stage for pretty much all of them so far - and most are flash length. But I have two that are out on submission right now from the end of last year - so I'll definitely have something to send in (unless all the subs get accepted which would be a happy problem to have).

Posted by: @pegeen

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I reread my Q2 story and it totally sucks. It just isn't percolating. I need to find a new entry point, maybe through my last character. Hate it when that happens.  

I'll take a look if you want a 2nd opinion / suggestions.

I submitted mine yesterday after a few crits. Only one person really got it, and he was way too positive. Ah well, perhaps another HM.

Finally popping in here, my INFP brain requires that I focus on one thing at a time otherwise I'll disappear off on a cotton candy cloud. Which brings up another point about pantsing. I've figured out if I completely pants it, I'll just go down a labyrinth of story telling from the history of a symbol on a shoe to a delightful day in the park with the sun glinting off the glossy coats of the otters the children chase in the river; but if I ever ever attempt to plot, I rebel against my own authority. So @toddjones you had me chortling at my own experience of attempting some form of hybrid, saggy pants, maybe one leg out?? experience. I've sort of settled on "firmly plot the beginning, firmly plot the end and let the characters tell the middle?" Thus far I haven't failed but I need to try something new to brake into the finals lol.

Speaking of which my Q2 entry has been done since December, but it's so outside of my usual story telling style and genre that I like...don't want to edit it and it's editing where the usual magic happens. I might get my first R this quarter... I feel like I'm on master chef: do I play it safe or take the risk to maybe(??) make it into the finals? Ah! Help.

Last note, literally @corbin-maxwell... I really really like it here...I'm querying for my novel that I spent 15 years writing, and I'm on 2 agent's maybe lists and...I sort of...want them...to reject me because I wanna keep doing this contest ☹️. I really like it here. Everyone's nice and wants each other to succeed. I don't wanna go to the cut throat place. Maybe I'll pull my queries ? .

Posted by: @watt_writes

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So @toddjones you had me chortling at my own experience of attempting some form of hybrid, saggy pants, maybe one leg out?? experience. I've sort of settled on "firmly plot the beginning, firmly plot the end and let the characters tell the middle?" Thus far I haven't failed but I need to try something new to brake into the finals lol.

This saggy pants style approach is more popular than I thought. Haha. 

Yes, I usually know my beginning and my end (without that I really would be walking around without pants) and then I know a bit about the middle for the journey.  Then I take where I thought I was going to start and fastforward a bit and start there.  Character(s), stage ... GO ... stuff happens, character wins too easy ... go back and build cranking up the difficulty .. watch the characters finish now.  

In regards to your last topic about novels and short stories. My plan this year is work on finish two novels I have almost done while keeping up with one new short story for WotF each quarter.  Doing both seems to keep my thoughts fresh. 

2023 Goal: finish one novel, write 4 new short stories.  Stretch goal: edit some older short storie(HM, SHM, SF) and start sending them out.  N 

And I've submitted.  Here's hoping it's as good as I think it is.   To be frank, that's unlikely as I have a very strong track record of having stories I think are strong get R, while stories I think are okay, get me HM.  

Posted by: @aivanther

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And I've submitted.  Here's hoping it's as good as I think it is.   To be frank, that's unlikely as I have a very strong track record of having stories I think are strong get R, while stories I think are okay, get me HM.  

You finished a story and submitted, that's a win in my book.  Just keep writing and let the ideas take you where they will.

@toddjones Oh yes, it's always a win.  I just find it funny that my personal judgement on stories seem to be in direct opposition to how they do.  Probably a lesson there on how I am when I get to close to my stories.

@watt_writes Hello from another INFP. I understand the value of plotting intellectually. However, it hurts my soul. I have to start with gestalt -- a scene that pops into my head fully formed. When I have an idea and try to plot, using my intellect, everything goes to poo. So I spend far too much time trying to lure the madness.  Here Kitty! Kitty!

I'm in your envisioning-the-scene-first camp, @pegeen, otherwise, things go to poo. My beginning process can be painfully unsettling as I discover the story, lots of restarts, lots of editing later, a whole lotta questioning myself what I'm doing. I'm in the thick of it now, just having started a new story, and something I'd like to get better at is the grit & trust needed to keep truckin' on. I gotta embrace the suck, so to speak.