Discussion: Q4 Volume 39

Posted by: @babooher

Posted by: @physa

Now that I've got my IOTF Q4 entry submitted,

It took me way too long to figure out what IOTF is. I'd like to say it's because of my laser-like focus on writing, but I have to admit it's probably just stress, low IQ, or some combination of both. Good luck with your illustration and your writing @physa!

Thanks for the encouragement @babooher! I can't imagine you could be suffering from low IQ considering your progress in WOTF contest. Super congrats by the way on your HMs SHMs and SF! That's so awesome! HOWEVER, it is a stressful world for all of us. Hopefully you manage to take time to do fun things to help. One of the ways I handle stress is to play around with digital art. It definitely helped with my Q2 twitching to have a Q4 piece to work on and learn new art tricks with. I wasn't able to concentrate much on my writing during that week or so of wondering what results would come for Q2...

Posted by: @annax

Posted by: @babooher

It took me way too long to figure out what IOTF is. I'd like to say it's because of my laser-like focus on writing, but I have to admit it's probably just stress, low IQ, or some combination of both.

Me too! I didn’t say it out loud though. It took me a long moment to figure out that IotF was the illustrator part of the contest. Silly us. ?

I'm sorry if the language in this post is a little rough.

I'm not sure if it is a lack of confidence, a kind of self-rejection or what, but I'm over 4k into what I hope to be my 4th Q entry and I think I just now got to the start of my story. Yeah, there's a lot to love in those 4,300 or so words, but I have a feeling they don't really get to the heart of it all. I posed this observation to my writing group and was told I might have to kill that darling as a "sacrifice to the bitch goddess Draft." And now I'm thinking nothing in that story is as good as that one comment.

If I were a drinking man...

Write on, write on, write on.

Posted by: @babooher

I'm sorry if the language in this post is a little rough.

I'm not sure if it is a lack of confidence, a kind of self-rejection or what, but I'm over 4k into what I hope to be my 4th Q entry and I think I just now got to the start of my story. Yeah, there's a lot to love in those 4,300 or so words, but I have a feeling they don't really get to the heart of it all. I posed this observation to my writing group and was told I might have to kill that darling as a "sacrifice to the bitch goddess Draft." And now I'm thinking nothing in that story is as good as that one comment.

If I were a drinking man...

Write on, write on, write on.

Do you mind passing it over and letting me take a look at it? I know what you mean, but there are always ways to go around things, to improve, to get to the point, and to save a draft you love.

Posted by: @babooher

I'm sorry if the language in this post is a little rough.

I'm not sure if it is a lack of confidence, a kind of self-rejection or what, but I'm over 4k into what I hope to be my 4th Q entry and I think I just now got to the start of my story. Yeah, there's a lot to love in those 4,300 or so words, but I have a feeling they don't really get to the heart of it all. I posed this observation to my writing group and was told I might have to kill that darling as a "sacrifice to the bitch goddess Draft." And now I'm thinking nothing in that story is as good as that one comment.

If I were a drinking man...

Write on, write on, write on.

Sometimes, what you get from those words is ideas and knowledge that informs the rest of the story, and makes the writing that comes after it better and more solidly grounded. Some details or passages may be able to be moved to other places, others you may be able to use in other stories. But even if not, the writing isn't wasted just because it's not in the final version.

Generally speaking, I cut more from my openings in the revision cycle than from anywhere else in the draft. What I wrote the first time, as the first draft opening, was generally what I needed to immerse myself in the world and the story. But what I have after edits is, I hope, what I need to hook the reader into that story and world instead, which can be quite a different thing.

Posted by: @babooher

I'm sorry if the language in this post is a little rough.

I'm not sure if it is a lack of confidence, a kind of self-rejection or what, but I'm over 4k into what I hope to be my 4th Q entry and I think I just now got to the start of my story. Yeah, there's a lot to love in those 4,300 or so words, but I have a feeling they don't really get to the heart of it all. I posed this observation to my writing group and was told I might have to kill that darling as a "sacrifice to the bitch goddess Draft." And now I'm thinking nothing in that story is as good as that one comment.

If I were a drinking man...

Write on, write on, write on.

I'm experiencing something similar with my Q4. I know I'm probably going to have to cut the first bit of the story, maybe even the whole first 2k words, but I'm still pressing through to finish the draft. When I used to anguish about this stuff and go back and try and fix it in the middle of drafting, I never finished anything and just floated from project to project. So, my plan is to finish what I have and then go back and cut what needs cutting and fix or rewrite what needs to be fixed or rewritten. I think there's still something there to rescue, but I won't know for sure until I get the whole draft out.

Thanks for the kind words of support and helpful insights. Last night I figured at least being able to diagnose the problem is a plus and the willingness to take corrective action is even more of a plus.

Posted by: @doctorjest

Sometimes, what you get from those words is ideas and knowledge that informs the rest of the story, and makes the writing that comes after it better and more solidly grounded. Some details or passages may be able to be moved to other places, others you may be able to use in other stories. But even if not, the writing isn't wasted just because it's not in the final version.

I couldn't agree more.

Posted by: @ajschultz6

So, my plan is to finish what I have and then go back and cut what needs cutting and fix or rewrite what needs to be fixed or rewritten.

I believe that is also going to be my plan of action.

Posted by: @annax

but there are always ways to go around things, to improve, to get to the point, and to save a draft you love.

I agree, but I currently think to do so with what I think will end up being cut will take more room than I'm willing to give at this juncture. Maybe if I wanted to expand to a novel, for example. But I'll hold off on any real cuts until I'm done.

Again, thank you guys for the support. This is a great community.

Just hit submit on my Q4. Earliest ever for me! Sci-Fi with a bit of humor (hopefully) instead of my usual fantasy. Glad to get it in so I can get back to a novel I've started - genuine high fantasy based on my Q3 entry, with what I think is a really solid premise. Something that I like, anyway, and since I'm the one who'll spend the most time in that world, that's a good thing.

Lots of time left for everyone, so keep at those keyboards! Best of luck to all!

Making good progress on my Q4 story, finally. I seem to be pantsing it more than normal this time. Still struggling to picture the final climax, ending, and denouement. But... I'm getting closer and closer to them.

One more month to go, everyone! You’ve got this! Get those fingers to that keyboard and keep going! Let’s all meet @lost_bard in Hollywood at the ceremony! ?

Posted by: @physa

Making good progress on my Q4 story, finally. I seem to be pantsing it more than normal this time. Still struggling to picture the final climax, ending, and denouement. But... I'm getting closer and closer to them.

Haha, if I had to outline, I’d never write anything. I’m a pure pantser. For me, outlining is like throwing a wet blanket over the fire of my imagination. Or maybe I’m just lazy  Probably the latter.

Posted by: @dommichaels

Posted by: @physa

Making good progress on my Q4 story, finally. I seem to be pantsing it more than normal this time. Still struggling to picture the final climax, ending, and denouement. But... I'm getting closer and closer to them.

Haha, if I had to outline, I’d never write anything. I’m a pure pantser. For me, outlining is like throwing a wet blanket over the fire of my imagination. Or maybe I’m just lazy  Probably the latter.

There are some very successful, thoroughly non-lazy writers who feel this way too, though. I can't recall if it's from the WotF workshop or from somewhere else (my memory is rock solid on certain things, hazy on others), but one writer spoke about the need to preserve the energy of his first time writing it. And if he outlines the story first, then it's the outline where that first energy goes, rather than into the actual writing of the story itself.

I feel very similarly, myself. I tried outlining thoroughly for stories, as I know it can work really well for some writers, and I like to give things a try and see how they go for me. But I think I'm similar in this regard, if I outline more than the ballpark idea in my head, what I end up with tends to feel stilted and doesn't really capture my imagination or excitement when I'm writing it.

Over-planning, for me, kills the energy in my writing. So although I've given it a whirl, I don't tend to like it much.

@doctorjest 

Exactly. Pantsing versus outlining is just a difference of how we go about the creative process. I don't think one way or another should be normative - whatever works for you. For me the story feels way more organic, more real, when I fly by the seat of my pants, which is pretty much the way I go through life. I'm not a planner either. I like spontaneity.

Of course, I have to go back and adjust some things for consistency due to unexpected turns in the plot. But I think I'd have to do that even in an outline, it just wouldn't be in the form of prose editing. Normally, they are small tweaks. If it's a major rewrite, I realize I'm probably going off the rails and should reconsider that clever turn the story is taking.

Posted by: @doctorjest

Posted by: @dommichaels

Posted by: @physa

Making good progress on my Q4 story, finally. I seem to be pantsing it more than normal this time. Still struggling to picture the final climax, ending, and denouement. But... I'm getting closer and closer to them.

Haha, if I had to outline, I’d never write anything. I’m a pure pantser. For me, outlining is like throwing a wet blanket over the fire of my imagination. Or maybe I’m just lazy  Probably the latter.

There are some very successful, thoroughly non-lazy writers who feel this way too, though. I can't recall if it's from the WotF workshop or from somewhere else (my memory is rock solid on certain things, hazy on others), but one writer spoke about the need to preserve the energy of his first time writing it. And if he outlines the story first, then it's the outline where that first energy goes, rather than into the actual writing of the story itself.

I feel very similarly, myself. I tried outlining thoroughly for stories, as I know it can work really well for some writers, and I like to give things a try and see how they go for me. But I think I'm similar in this regard, if I outline more than the ballpark idea in my head, what I end up with tends to feel stilted and doesn't really capture my imagination or excitement when I'm writing it.

Over-planning, for me, kills the energy in my writing. So although I've given it a whirl, I don't tend to like it much.

Well considering how many HMs plus a silver @dommichaels has earned and the @doctorjest number of HMs, SHMs, and finalist results, I do feel better about the approach I'm taking for my Q4. Thanks for the insights into your writing processes. At the very least, I'm enjoying this story and the writing of it.  

The closest I get to an outline is a list of story ideas with possible arcs to follow. If an idea doesn't conform to expectations I go to the next on the list.  

I enjoy the thrill of the chase, the spontaneity of the moment, the character that grows with every metaphoric moment.  

Good luck to pantsers and plotters and plantsers alike! 

"Plantser" here, fo' sho'.

There's more energy in pantsing, but there's also a risk of getting lost in the middle (for me). I'm determined to find the ending of my current pantsed story.

Yikes! My characters are entering into the climax scene. I sure hope they make it out okay. Eyes closed, heart beating wildly, I try to enter into the climax scene with them.  

@physa - Sounds like you and your characters are getting ready to have an orga . . . nism.

Posted by: @dragonchef

@physa - Sounds like you and your characters are getting ready to have an orga . . . nism.

  Um... not that kind of climax. . I mean the scene in a story where the hero has to face of with the evil and make a tough choice  .

So, my critique group spotted a mistake I had made. All I could say is I'm dumb. So, my friend took some inspiration from the Litany Against Fear and produced this:

Okay, after perusing the feedback received from my Q4 first draft, I've decided to simplify the plot, start at a different place to show why they are where they are, trim the number of characters, use a different POV character, and add more internal conflicts with heightened heart's desire. So far so good. Still have 2 weeks...  

Posted by: @physa

Okay, after perusing the feedback received from my Q4 first draft, I've decided to simplify the plot, start at a different place to show why they are where they are, trim the number of characters, use a different POV character, and add more internal conflicts with heightened heart's desire. So far so good. Still have 2 weeks...  

Great googly moogly.! Sounds like you're rewriting the whole thing. I hope everything turns out just the way you want it. Maybe come February you can say . . .

Grrr... Don't be whipping out that icon yet!

Gave me a heart attack.

I know, I know, Q4 isn't even over, but it was an emotional reaction, not a logical one. ? (I think that's a bottle of Pepto)

Thanks @dragonchef for your vote of confidence, In deference to @axeminister's emotional well being I won't use the quote option. Oh how we would all love to use that sign, though.  Keep writing!

Posted by: @axeminister

Grrr... Don't be whipping out that icon yet!

Gave me a heart attack.

I know, I know, Q4 isn't even over, but it was an emotional reaction, not a logical one. ? (I think that's a bottle of Pepto)

Lo siento mucho, amigo mio! Please to keep your axe at bay . I did not mean for you to seek out a cardiologist for your ❤️ .

Just submitted. Best of luck everybody!

This story took more editing time than expected, but it has now been submitted. 

I finally got my Q4 submitted. Now my fate is in the hands of the gods...er, judges.